I'd like to propose a new answer.

"Noah - Now with more boost." (antriebverliebt) 04/26/2017 at 13:48 • Filed to: None

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A Miata is the perfect car for a summertime back road adventure with a friend. But what about every other imaginable situation? Miatas are cool, but their impractical nature is part of the reason why suggesting them to people is funny in the first place. I think the real jack of all trades is a used luxury sedan. There are just SO MANY options in the $3000 - $6000 price range, from the legendary LS400 to an E46 330i, and beyond.

You won’t find anything with a roof and 5 seats that drives like a Miata. But there’s nothing wrong with a good sports sedan! A 90s or early 2000s 3 series will be a lot of fun if you can handle the maintenance yourself. At this point, taking care of an aging NA or NB Miata won’t be dramatically different. Your luck with reliability will come down to the previous owner’s diligence. Anyway -the bigger BMW sixes are torquey, smooth, and indestructible. Just make sure the cooling system has been looked after and buy a good set of metric wrenches.

To be frank, I think that a decent sports sedan is all you need on public roads, and if you’re pushing your car hard enough to be dissatisfied with a quick 3 series, that’s irresponsible and you need to start autocrossing or HPDE. The suggestion that your average teenager will be doing enough high performance driving in a Miata to justify the loss of a roof, 3 extra spaces for friends, and massive trunk? It’s a little ridiculous IMO!

If German “reliability” isn’t a funny joke to you, maybe go for a G35 instead. 3 pedal examples will be harder to find, but you’ll be going even faster in a straight line. And like the BMWs, the G35 has the added benefit of being a pedestrian 4 door version of a more desirable coupe. Craigslist prices will be more reasonable and the low mileage examples haven’t all been snapped up and riced out by teenagers. I’m actually surprised that you don’t see more young track nut modifying these. I don’t like the VQ but I do think these are aging quite well, and aftermarket support is definitely there.

The elephant in the room. Literally. Though at around 3700 lb, the LS400 was relatively light for it’s class back in the day. My car weighs just over two tons, and a contemporary 740iL weighs in at 4,288 lb. All of the above are solid options if your priority is eating up highway miles with ease. Also, V8s. What other reason do you need? If most of your commute is stop and go traffic, it’s hard to beat the comfort of a big old boat (gas mileage enthusiasts need not apply). An LS400 will be the easiest to maintain (beyond the 1UZ’s timing belt, which needs to be changed every 60k) and E38s are like any late nineties BMW - manageable when cared for properly, but disastrous if you pick up a neglected example.

S500s from this era are also cheap (and look great, check out Tavarish’s build on his channel), but their air suspension systems are notoriously expensive to fix so approach with caution. And finally - if you’re especially sadistic, the German stuff can be had with a V12 to pour your money into. My drug of choice would be the E32 750iL. It has not one but TWO ecus to troubleshoot when you have a problem because BMW couldn’t figure out how to control both cylinder banks with one computer.

Eighties classics like the 535i and XJ6 can still be had for cheap. DDing a classic car exactly isn’t the safest thing to do, but hey, neither is driving an NA MIiata! And contrary to what people on the internet will tell you, they can be just as reliable as a new car once you iron out the kinks. The ‘89 635csi I drove for a year never left me stranded or broke in a catastrophic way. I didn’t put a dime into that car beyond oil changes and brake pads. I wouldn’t expect that from a Jag though. But eighties Mercs were just as overengineered as the BMWs, and even cheaper. 560SELs can be had in great condition, and their interiors have aged to the point of being are delightfully vintage, with the yellow gauges and unusual color combinations. There is a reason why these are still used as taxi cabs in third-world countries. They’re bomb proof and you can find examples with well over 200k on them that are still in great condition.

So - if you’re looking for a cheap first car, I’d check out a few 4 doors before committing to something small and light. You’ll have “space, grace, and pace” as Jaguar puts it. The practicality (and acceleration...) of a sports sedan or V8 barge is ideal on a day-to-day basis.

TheHondaBro > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 13:49

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Anything to rid this space of the boring, overplayed Miata.

Noah - Now with more boost. > TheHondaBro 04/26/2017 at 13:52

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Not gonna lie, I’d like an NA. That’d be fun for Spring and Summer errands. (but that’s about it)

Honeybunchesofgoats > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 13:56

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XJ6 is the wrong Jag.

PushToStart > TheHondaBro 04/26/2017 at 14:00

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fr have you driven a Miata? Not saying it’s not a little overplayed but it’s hyped for a reason.

djmt1 > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:05

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Who cut the back off your 330i?

I have another burner, try to guess it! > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:05

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Integra

Numerous

The

Exponentially

Growing

Right

Answer

Land_Yacht_225 > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:14

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I have argued and will continue to argue that my S600 can do anything. It’s fast, it can swallow the entirety of my dorm room including TV and computers, it’s obviously great for long distances (though a town car will still beat it for ride quality). Its versatile, seats four, has room to haul, and can haul itself through a standing quarter 1/10 of a second faster than a Ferrari 575. It’s also heavy enough to conquer snow on Continental DWS all seasons like a Range Rover.

Bytemite > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:31

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I had the legendary LS400. I can’t vouch for it enough, it is really that good. Then I got a Miata. There’s a reason why it is the answer. Weight is everything and lugging around a huge trunk and 4 extra seats 99% of the time as a single dude in his 20s is not desirable. There’s practicality, and then there’s “practicality”-the kind that makes single people buy 5 seater crossovers as their first car, and middle aged office workers buy full size trucks as their commuters.

Also, V8 does not = fast. A 4 speed slushbox and 2 tons will make any of these V8s accelerate to 60 slower than my Miata. Also, they have no driving feel, so as an enthusiast recommending them to fellow enthusiasts who like driving, goes completely against what they’re looking for.

OpposResidentLexusGuy - USE20, XF20, XU30 and Press Cars > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:41

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LS400 is the answer but I would recommend the 98-00 models. Faster, smoother, look better, and the timing belt for the 1UZ is 90k not 60k.

functionoverfashion > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 14:58

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I beleive I made a proposal along these lines a few weeks back, in the name of the Volvo wagon I was buying at the time.

http://functionoverfashion.kinja.com/the-answer-is-always-volvo-wagon-1793092367

I’d also submit my 5-speed E46 wagon. I’ll see your 330i and raise you AWD and a long roof. There’s not much I can’t do with that car.

arl > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 15:07

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Yes, I do believe you are right. My dream used car garage is-

1. Lexus Ls400

2. NA Miata

3. Ford Ranger

Noah - Now with more boost. > Bytemite 04/26/2017 at 15:41

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IDK which Miata you’re referring to? But the NA and NB are not faster in a straight line, that’s for sure. The LS isn’t the best comparison because it’s the slowest out of anything in that segment. For everything else, it’s a simple power to weight equation, no? The big boats reach 60 in 6.5-7.5 seconds which is dramatically faster than a Miata, which will run out of steam to an even greater extent on the highway than a V8 barge will too.

Our lifestyles must be different though. That is also an important consideration. I take my friends on day trips all the time so a back seat is nice. The driving roads around here are also nonexistent, and Boston area streets aren’t the most well-maintained. Furthermore, I do a lot of highway driving.

Noah - Now with more boost. > Land_Yacht_225 04/26/2017 at 15:43

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Yeah man it’s hard to disagree with all that. Some people REALLY want that lightweight feel and small size. But beyond those two things, an autobahn cruiser is just the best.

Noah - Now with more boost. > djmt1 04/26/2017 at 15:44

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Me! Whoops. (I saw an M3 swapped wagon last summer... EPIC)

Noah - Now with more boost. > functionoverfashion 04/26/2017 at 15:45

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There’s not much I can’t do with that car.

Except for sliding around! Though in the snow... I bet it’s epic.

Noah - Now with more boost. > Honeybunchesofgoats 04/26/2017 at 15:45

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I do like a good X308. Nice interiors and a nice shape too. But it’s hard to recommend the non-R due to those trans issues. IIRC the R has a different auto box? So that’s an option, but they’re getting expensive!

Noah - Now with more boost. > OpposResidentLexusGuy - USE20, XF20, XU30 and Press Cars 04/26/2017 at 15:46

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I stand corrected!

Noah - Now with more boost. > arl 04/26/2017 at 15:47

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Sounds perfect! The Ranger rounds things out nicely

AMGtech - now with more recalls! > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 15:47

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For summer fun:

For everything else:

Cheaper versions of both can be had easily. You could get an older SV650 and a 2000-2002 E430 for under $6k all day. Mine are obviously more than that, but you can’t beat two wheels for summer fun. Miatas to me are entirely pointless, I hate being in them, they’re slow, they’re no more reliable than my E55, and they take a bit of money and effort to make them what I would want them to be.

Noah - Now with more boost. > I have another burner, try to guess it! 04/26/2017 at 15:48

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I used to hate FWD cars. Now? I think nineties Hondas are just the best and would love a CR-V swapped ‘teg in my 100 car fantasy garage.

Shift24 > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 16:32

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The correct answer to me has been any manual Honda. I mean Honda is known for being the best at how a manual should feel, crisp, effortless and precise. Just look at the list

Any year Accord with a manual you could start with the CB7 and 9, up to current. The V6 coupes since 03 have always been seriously quick, the new sedan sports are nice, and Mr. Regular loved the 5th gen wagon .

S2K known as the real answer to the miata question.

Countless Civics, hatches, Si, and CRXs that keep wining AutoX, Solo, and SCCA road race divisions. There is a reason they became so popular in the 90s

Acura has countless: Legend (sedan and coupe), Integra, RSX, TL (Type-s and SH-AWD), and CL.

There are too many to count and if you pick one, get bored? Pick another because almost all have some sort of aftermarket support, and if not? Swap it for vtec yo.

Easy way put it, if you are like the most people who think Miatas are overplayed, Honda is the answer.

Bytemite > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 16:50

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Power to weight equations aren’t accurate at measuring the acceleration rate. Just as important as HP curve and weight, are gear ratios in tranny and diff, flywheel weight, wheel weight, and tire circumference. But, yeah an NA Miata will be slower in terms of numbers.

There is an important distinction though because a 2,000 lb car accelerates from 0-30 very quickly and tapers out to 60 while a 4,000 lb car accelerates from 0-30 slowly but builds up speed to 60. BUT the acceleration rate from 0-30 will be higher in the lighter car, than the acceleration rate of the 30-60 in the V8 sedan. That is why the feeling of acceleration ain’t the same as the feeling you get driving a lightweight, low powered, slow car fast. The heavier and more isolated the car, which those sedans are, the less speed you feel.

Which makes me question, what are you looking to obtain in having faster acceleration? Is it for the joy you get behind the wheel, or is it for just being faster than other people on the road?

If you enjoy driving other people around then sure, of course an LS400 is awesome. I loved mine. But I’ve daily driven my NA and now I’m currently dailying a Veloster Rally, and I gotta say the Vel is just way too much car for my every day needs...plus I can never enjoy going fast with passengers in it because they get carsick so what’s the point? I’m thinking of selling it to get another 2 seater. It’s a toss up between AP1 S2k or MR2 Spyder!

Noah - Now with more boost. > Bytemite 04/26/2017 at 19:40

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That is why the feeling of acceleration ain’t the same as the feeling you get driving a lightweight, low powered, slow car fast. The heavier and more isolated the car, which those sedans are, the less speed you feel.

ahhh ok now I understand!

Noah - Now with more boost. > Shift24 04/26/2017 at 19:41

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I can see that. Matt Farah has done a TON of fast Honda one takes and I’ve enjoyed them all. Especially the crazy swaps

Shift24 > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 20:46

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And the best part is that there a ton of them out there like a miata so it’s not a crime to chop, swap, or drop

functionoverfashion > Noah - Now with more boost. 04/26/2017 at 22:17

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True, sliding on dry pavement isn’t really happening. But in the snow, man it’s a blast. I’ve had it up at Team O’Neil rally school a couple times, too; also fun. (edit) I should specify - the E46. I haven’t had the Volvo in the snow yet!